5 Reasons Why “Tiva” Should Never Happen [NCIS]

NCIS Tony and Ziva

To say that I’m a big fan of NCIS is probably the biggest understatement ever.

I may not have watched from the moment the pilot aired but once I found it, I caught up fast and have been with it ever since. I’ve seen every episode multiple times and I’ve even penned a few gen fanfics (generic fanfiction stories – meaning they weren’t romantic in nature).

So when I say that I don’t ever want “Tiva” (aka Tony and Ziva as a couple) to happen, know that I’m saying it purely from love. Love for both Tony and Ziva and especially, love for the entire show. As much as I enjoy the teasing and the flirting, and despite the fact that I giggled along with the rest of the audience when the two of them had to fake sex with each other as part of a case, I don’t ever want it to go any farther than that.

There are many, many reasons that I can think of for why “Tiva” should never happen, but here are just a few.

1. NCIS could end up as a soap opera all about “Tiva.”

Right now the thing that makes NCIS great is the dynamic of the entire cast.

From Gibbs all the way down to Palmer, everyone has their place and if anyone is off camera for too long, we miss them. But if Tony and Ziva ended up together, more of the show would center on them and possibly take away from the rest of the cast.

NCIS would just be another soap opera with various cast mates jumping in and out of bed together and the last thing I want to see is some sort of “Grey’s NCIS” on Tuesday nights.

2. Neither of them are the type to settle down.

Okay so let’s just say for a moment that everything goes down like a fairy tale and Tony and Ziva end up together.

How long do you really think it will last?

As far as we’ve seen on the show, neither of them has ever had a longtime relationship that didn’t end tragically – Tony losing Jeanne after she found out he lied to her for so long and Ziva losing Michael when he was shot..by Tony.

Other than that, we only really know that Tony has played the field lot in his past and Ziva, well actually we don’t know much about Ziva’s love life but it’s not like she’s had other longtime relationships. So what does this all mean? Well I think it means that even if the two of them got together, given both of their track records, they’d be more likely to break up.

3. Their fights wouldn’t be nearly as much fun to watch.

Tony and Ziva bickering is hilarious. Why? Because it doesn’t mean a thing.

It’s just two co-workers letting off steam and actually, the more they fight, the more I think they really care about each other (in a platonic way of course). But if they were a couple, suddenly those fights of theirs wouldn’t be nearly as cute. Who likes to watch a couple fight? It makes me uncomfortable and that’s the last thing I want from my favorite TV show.

4. The window is closed.

Face it folks, it’s just been too long now.

There’s too much history between Tony and Ziva for a relationship between them to be anything but awkward. Heck, he actually killed the man she loved and that’s not exactly something you get over easily. Sure, Ziva has forgiven him enough to work with him again and share a friendship. But to love someone after that? I don’t know.

Maybe if the two of them had gotten together way back when they’d first met each other, but now I think it’s just too late.

5. It could literally kill them.

Tony and Ziva make a pretty good team and doing the kind of work they do, it means that they quite literally hold each other’s lives in their hands when they are on a case together.

Any kind of distraction could mean the difference between life and death and being a couple on their job would definitely be a distraction. I know I’m stretching it a little with this one but, come on, is the idea of “Tiva” really worth their lives???

So there they are, a few of the reasons why I think that Tony and Ziva should remain partners and friends, but nothing more.

I know that I’m probably in the minority but that’s how I feel and again, I just want to remind ya’ll (you know, before you start flaming away), that it’s from my love of the show and the characters that I don’t want it to happen.

Okay, I’ve said my peace. Fire away!

Follow me on Twitter @mokibobolink

By Michelle Carlbert | March 29, 2011 | 69 Comments

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http://pulse.yahoo.com/_CHFJLOURUEVT6D33MGUYT5IN5I David

JEEZ…I hadn’t thought of that possibility–thanks for making me throw up in my mouth just a little bit.

As a “science nerd” I enjoy shows like this (as well as the CSI franchises) but in the case of this show, I can only take so much. It’s a little like CSI meets Gilmore Girls, set in DC. The hyperkinetic bantering gets downright annoying after a while. Helllloooo…murder investigation…criminal on the loose…remember? Arrest murderer now…tease probie / playfully harass Ziva later.
http://www.daemonstv.com/ Eric

I agree with your reasons Moki. Those two don’t belong together.

I personally thought that Tony had better couple chemistry with Kate so it’s hard for me to see Ziva and him work it out.

Anonymous

You know, I gotta agree with you on Kate and Tony. I actually could at least picture those two as a possible couple. I could never see that with Tony and Ziva. Even as much as I enjoyed the flirting, I could still never see it.
Anonymous

You know, I gotta agree with you on Kate and Tony. I actually could at least picture those two as a possible couple. I could never see that with Tony and Ziva. Even as much as I enjoyed the flirting, I could still never see it.
Anonymous

You know, I gotta agree with you on Kate and Tony. I actually could at least picture those two as a possible couple. I could never see that with Tony and Ziva. Even as much as I enjoyed the flirting, I could still never see it.
Anonymous

You know, I gotta agree with you on Kate and Tony. I actually could at least picture those two as a possible couple. I could never see that with Tony and Ziva. Even as much as I enjoyed the flirting, I could still never see it.
Anonymous

You know, I gotta agree with you on Kate and Tony. I actually could at least picture those two as a possible couple. I could never see that with Tony and Ziva. Even as much as I enjoyed the flirting, I could still never see it.
Anonymous

You know, I gotta agree with you on Kate and Tony. I actually could at least picture those two as a possible couple. I could never see that with Tony and Ziva. Even as much as I enjoyed the flirting, I could still never see it.
Kat

Ewwie! Sorry, but I can’t do the Tony/Kate thing. They bickered like siblings. I would know, because my brother and I do the exact same thing (minus the occasional innuendo, but on the show that was only because Tony was such a flirt in general). Tony and Ziva are definitely too sexy for sibling-ness, and they’re a little better for me, but as a couple they would be too awkward. Unfortunately. I love me the Tiva, but objectively it makes no sense….

Spot 13

I would think that the talented writers and cast of this show could pull a Tiva pairing off without making it stupid or sappy. I think Tiva could still enjoy their little spats and it would be alot more fun than the nasty snarky fighting we’re been getting lately. Love NCIS however it plays out but would love to see Tony and Ziva step up their game so to speak

Anonymous

Well I do have a lot of faith in the writers and one thing’s for sure, if it did happen, I definitely wouldn’t stop watching. Guess we’ll all have to wait and see.
http://twitter.com/angelmoongirl AngelMoon Girl

Agree agree agree to the umpteenth power. You are so right. These writers are TALENTED; I’d have no fear that Tiva would “overcome” the show. It could be so interesting if it was done right, ya know??

Halidesm

I could not agree more. I watch this show from Australia and I love it, I love them all. Honestly it is the best tv show at the moment…this rocks while glee sucks….but it is not the type of show for a relationship of that kind…it should be left as it is…

Anonymous

Yay, so glad someone agrees with me. LOL.

janet

i really hope they get together it could work and no it could never be like a soap opera sorry but you are wrong with your 5 reasons.

bill

Sorry but YOU are wrong. The author of this article makes very valid points and I would wish more fans would think like the author.

Anonymous

Aw thanks, glad to know you agree, though I’m okay with people having opinions different than mine. )

Anonymous

No worries, this was just my opinion and everyone’s allowed to have their own.

Blix

You certainly have very valid reasons, and I agree, I don’t want Tony and Ziva together, never have. As for Rivkin, Ziva is just as to blame for his death as Tony is for actually pulling the trigger in self-defense: she knew he was running an op in the US, she knew he’d killed those two agents in LA, she was harboring him in her apartment while he wasn’t even supposed to BE in the US to begin with. Her keeping all those secrets invariably led to his death when he attacked Tony. As for forgiveness, let’s not forget she implied she’d have been happier if perhaps Tony was the one who died in his confrontation with Rivkin, AFTER pulling his own loaded weapon on him in Israel. There’s a lot she’s done that requires begging forgiveness on HER part, too.

As far as the soap opera-ness goes, let’s face it, NCIS already went there. Most of the relationship between Tony and Ziva from mid-season 6 on through early season 8 was soap opera-ish in nature. The more they back off this ridiculous will-they-won’t-they-did-they-could-they baloney, the better this show gets.

Personally, thought Tony had better chemistry with Kate, not that I’d ever have wanted them to get together, either, as I’ve never understood television’s insistence that every show on tv has to have romantic pairing. If they want to go that way, NCIS should have stuck with Abby and McGee, that pairing was pretty innocuous and harmless fun.

Anonymous

“The more they back off this ridiculous will-they-won’t-they-did-they-could-they baloney, the better this show gets” – yeah that does seem to be the case, doesn’t it?

Totally agree with about Tony and Kate, too. Not that I ever wanted them together but to me those two definitely had the better chemistry. I also agree about Abby and McGee. That relationship was set up early enough and without any drama so I think it could have worked. A part of me thinks it may still.

ninjabear

Really? I don’t know about that. I always thought the Tony-Kate relationship came off more as him being Kate’s annoying little brother. The affection was there, but I think he pissed her off a little too frequently…

Cheyennejsmith

I agree. It has been too long, and when I think of them making out for more than an assignment it just seems… weird. Both of them are so nosy into each others lives as well… Like, right now neither can seem to get over the fact that the other has a significant other. Tony is constantly on the Ray thing, even though it’s obvious he’s got a thing going on with EJ. And Ziva is with Ray (for almost a year now) and yet she can’t get over the fact that Tony is with EJ. UGH! I love the show to death, but the constant “Why are you with her?” “Why are you with him?” thing gets annoying. I love their playful banter, and their arguments, and if they got together all of that would change. Sorry, I needed to vent!

Anonymous

No worries, vent away! LOL. I know exactly what you mean. Each of them continuously asking about the other’s hook-ups is getting so very old I can barely stand it. At this point I basically annoy it and hope that it goes away.

Vberry2103

I totally agree with your assessment!

Anonymous

Cool! Glad to hear it! )

Mewofford

1. I give you Hodgins and Angela on Bones as proof this need not happen.
2. People break up and get back together all the time. Heck, even my own parents got divorced and then remarried. And it seems we’re being led to believe Ziva wants something permanent and Tony is searching for something that just might be permanent too. Why not together?
3. Having been married, trust me the fights can get hysterically funny – after the fact. “Why the heck were we even fighting about something like the toothpaste?”
4. As long as one of them is breathing, there’s hope. The window never closes on love. If that makes me an insipid romantic, so be it.
5. This one, I don’t know. I think they already care so much for each other, even if it is not romantic love, that they deal with this one a day-by-day basis. And after 6 years of watching this team work together, I think each and everyone would do something stupid if they thought it would save one of their teammates. That’s one of the reasons Gibbs chooses them. That innate sense of loyalty.

Totally.

Anonymous

Well I gave my points why it wouldn’t and you gave yours why it would. Now people can see both opinions, so thanks for that. Truly. I really don’t mind people having opinions that differ from mine, especially when they put it so well and without rancor. Great comment! Thanks! )
http://twitter.com/angelmoongirl AngelMoon Girl

Well said, Mewofford! I concur on all points and I wish the writers had the backbone to make “Tiva” canon by at least the last season so we could see all those enjoyable “first”s. It needn’t be anything grand or climactic. Just sweet and subtle is fine by me
Kath

1) I can’t say anything about Bones, I don’t watch it. The biggest difference between f.ex CSI-NY (Danny and Lindsay) and NCIS is the structure of the show. Other procedurals most often deal with two cases in the same episode which are worked on by different teams, supervised and tied together by the leader of the shift and the mini-teams are shuffled around a lot depending on the individual cases. Ziva and Tony work together all the time which would, if they were a couple, open the window for a lot of problems and a lot of little glances, bigger scenes and problems on screen which would take away the focus of why I watch NCIS: for the cases and for the team. Additionally the cast is smaller, four core members. I would not like to see Gibbs or Tim in a romatic relationship with Ziva either.
If I want to watch romance I’ll watch another show.
2) Yes, indeed. But there is something essential I think is missing that acts as glue during difficult times and lets couples endure and go on between Tony and Ziva. Trust. Not the trust of team members, trusting that the other has your six but trust that the romantic partner will never hurt you emotionally. Ziva showed time and time again that she has difficulties separating professioanl behaviour and personal feelings. Ari, her father, Rivkin, Tony and last week Ray. Ray did nothing wrong. He followed orders which she should understand very well as a former Mossad officer and it wasn’t even something big he didn’t tell her. She couldn’t tell Gibbs that she shot Ari on her father’s orders to gain his trust, wasn’t that much worse than Ray not telling her why he is in DC? What would happen if Tony has to go undercover and flirt with someone? Or the director/Gibbs orders him to keep his mouth shut about an operation? Will she react unreasonable like last week with Ray?
3) I agree that that fighting (and making up) can be a lot of fun but the fun ends when you can’t trust someone not to pulls their gun on you or smashes their fist into your throat.
4) Yes. I could see them getting together. In ten or twelve years after both of them had long lasting, healthy, nice relationships with someone else, preferable with amiable break ups with their partners. They need time to heal and I can’t see them provifing stability for each other and keeping it outside the office.
5) Again, just as long as the problem does not touch on Ziva’s issues. There was more than one spot where it prevented her from having Tony’s back especially. Taking a bullet because a terrorist shoots at him? Every time. Taking his side when she is angry at him? Maybe. And maybe is not good enough.

Vick53

Thank you!!!! I agree with you 100%!!! Keep the NCIS characters just the way they are!!! Co-workers/close friends!
Krumseeker15

u happen to make good points. as much as i love the idea of them together, the show wouldnt be the same if they were… for now i’m satisfied with just the fanfics as for all the commenters… was i the only one who say Kate and Gibbs woulda been great together???
Xenascully

Perfectly said, my dear! Sharing this… I definitely loved #1.
http://pulse.yahoo.com/_47FTOAV2SLXLFGFUHWGXE4ZSWM Catherine

I absolutely love Tiva and I would literally be over the moon if they got together, but I won’t deny that some of your points make sense.
Especially the last two.
I think they definitely would have been much better if they had gotten together in earlier seasons. Now it would seem somewhat forced and done only to please Tiva fans (unless the managed to do it really REALLY well).
And I would rather them apart than dead because one of them was too busy worrying about the other.
Although in all honesty, I think that the last point is valid whether or not they are together. Remember Ziva sheltering Tony from bombs and guns in Boxed In and Dead Air? Or Tony following her while she diffused that bomb? They care about each other like that anyway.
I’m not going to go off and rant because you’ve spoken against Tiva, but I do want them together. Only if they do it well though. It’s one of those things that will either be spectacularly good or spectacularly horrible, there’s no in between. If the writer’s script it properly, Tiva has the potential to be amazing. If not, then the show’s integrity will literally die. Fast.
And no one wants to see that.

Kath

Dead Air was one of the key episodes that showed me why I would despise them being together even more/romantically: forced and illogical Tiva scenes. That tackle and then them staying down staring at each othe rwith cow eyes instead of securing the scene was done purely to please the Tivas. A good agent knowing that there’s a bomb should never react that slowly and if his speach issues somehow influenced his capabilities he should not have gone into the field in the first place. All it did for me was portrait Tony as incompetent. If there were more scenes like that I would stop watching the show altogether.

May64

While you do make good points, I would love to see Tony and Ziva together…not yet, but maybe towards the end of the series (which, I hope won’t be for a long, long time). I can’t really see them with other people…especially that EJ girl. Ugh! Number 2 is so right…they aren’t the type, but I think they’d be perfect for each other in time. As for Kate, their chemistry to me was more of the sibling kind. She was kind of condescending to Tony.

I did love how you explained your points though. I really think the show should just focus on the cases and the characters in relation to the cases…and leave the love lives to the other shows.
AmeliaMay

I can see both sides of the Tony & Ziva argument but I think that the NCIS writers are smart enough and talented enough to keep the ‘telenovela’ that would be Tony & Ziva on the side, like they did with the McGee & Abby relationship. Also, I think that they could make an intimate relationship work. Tony may play the field but over the course of the last season or so, the viewers haven’t heard much of his ‘adventures.’ And remember in A Man Walks Into A Bar…when Ziva tells Rachel about her relationships and that she ‘wants to settle down? (Yes she is with Ray but who keeping track ) And I think that the Tony/Jeanne and Ziva/Michael incidences strengthed their working relationship and their friendship, Ziva was Tony’s rock through his heartbreak with Jeanne and although Ziva hated Tony for killing Michael, I think that once she realized that he risked his life to save hers both from Michael and in Israel, she understood that he cared about her deeply. (not to be misconstrued as jealousy). And your point 5 is true, but haven’t they already risked their lives for each other for a reason other than work? On a lighter note, I think that their bickering would be just as good, you know, them keeping the banter up to keep the rest of the team in the dark…I don’t think much would change. And I think Ziva would still chew Tony out even if they were a couple. Now I’m not saying I’m a die-hard Tiva fan –in fact I hate the acronyms that are made out of the characters names haha– but it would be nice to close the book on this relationship once and for all….it’s been drawn out too long…either make them a couple or leave the idea alone…I’m the hopeless romantic so I’m pulling for the first option the most LOL

Anonymous

But why would Tony want to be with someone who seems to think he requires regular “chewing out”. I don’t think he does – his values at core are all in the right place to me. It’s hers I have a lot of problems with.

Mel

So honestly, none of these reasons are ones I havn’t heard before. And whereas I totally respect your right to feel this way, I just don’t think you “get” them. Maybe you have to be a bit of a romantic, and willing to take a giant leap of faith, but isn’t that what love is all about? As Tony said once, “The heart wants what it wants. ” These two deserve to be happy, and I think they’ve changed in the six years they’ve known one another, and made every mistake possible, and still come out on top. Let them be happy….together. JMO.

Jrampdewguard388

Maybe they are already happy…with other people.
Anonymous

I don’t think you have to be a romantic so much as someone wearing Tiva-tinted spectacles to want this relationship. I think it’s toxic, and while they might deserve to be happy, I don’t think that happiness lies with each other. For Ziva’s sake, I think a nice, Jewish guy who ISN’T an spy or agent of some kind – either in Mossad, NCIS or the CIA would be her best bet. Someone who will cherish and take care of her.

For Tony, I think someone who understands him and likes him for who he is, without always looking down on him or wanting to change him would be best for him. Neither of them can be that person to each other. They are BOTH too high maintenance and too damaged.

I also really hate this insistence that somehow there has to be a romance of some kind on the show. There doesn’t. It works much better without. A lot of us DO watch for the team and the crime stories. Abby and Ducky and McGee have become very much the B team while Tony, Ziva and Gibbs (and Vance come to that) have become the A team. I much preferred it when all the team interacted equally and one half wasn’t forever shunted to one side to make room for the romantic entanglements and angst-fests of the other.
http://twitter.com/MissAnnaMack AnnaMarie M

Just can’t see how Tony could be happy with someone who regularly rips him a new one whenever the mood suits, doesn’t respect a thing about what he’s made of & has already assaulted him once…but hey, think I did read this plot in a harlequin once…..
personally I think Tony fit better with Paula or Abby although he seems happy with EJ at the moment
Blix

Just can’t see why Tony should or would want to be with someone who felt they needed to constantly berate him or verbally abuse him. Where’s the “romance” in that? Never could understand why every show on tv needed to have a love interest story, anyway. In terms of NCIS, specifically, it gets spectacularly in the way.

If they ever got together, they’d kill each other, or more likely, Ziva would kill Tony with his own gun and then blame him for forcing her to do it. She’s already pulled his own weapon on him as it is.

Abbie

I agree with you, especially #4. Even though I am a bit of a Tiva fan But I wouldn’t mind having a more than friendly flashback scene… heh heh.
Thithya

I agree with you that it wouldn’t be fun to watch them argue, flirt, ect…, if they end up together. But on the other I doesn’t think that the windows is closed…as you said. The perfect timing for get together is now because their relationship has grown SO MUCH during the last 5 years. Tony has grown A LOT since season 3 and Ziva is also different now and quiet frankly I couldn’t see them as a couple in the previous since. Not until the season 7. They have become closer and more open to each other.
I don’t think that the show would end up like a soap opera if the writers decide to let tiva happened. So far they managed to develop TV’s number one show so I think they now how make a storyline for them without ruining the show.
That said, I think Tony and Ziva should get together when NCIS ends. Hopefully that isn’t going to happened any time soon
Thithya

I agree with you that it wouldn’t be fun to watch them argue, flirt, ect…, if they end up together. But on the other I doesn’t think that the windows is closed…as you said. The perfect timing for get together is now because their relationship has grown SO MUCH during the last 5 years. Tony has grown A LOT since season 3 and Ziva is also different now and quiet frankly I couldn’t see them as a couple in the previous seasons. Not until season 7. They have become closer and more open to each other.
I don’t think that the show would end up like a soap opera if the writers decide to let tiva happened. So far they managed to develop TV’s number one show so I think they know how to make a storyline for them without ruining the show.
That said, I think Tony and Ziva should get together when NCIS ends. Hopefully that isn’t going to happened any time soon
wtchncis

How about because Ziva is such a b*** and Tony deserves better.
A_Homo_On_The _Make

Tiva is full of remorse, and it is most delicious!
Anonymous

You missed out the most important – she has no respect for him, and has behaved abusively towards him, throwing him to the ground when he had a broken arm and trying to get him thrown off the team. She also takes great delight in putting him down all the time. And he only killed her boyfriend in self-defense and because he murdered a US federal agent on US soil – ie Tony was doing his job. Ziva on the other lied to the team and betrayed them. Quite frankly she isn’t good enough for Tony.

I agree with some of your other points. The more Tiva we get, the less I like the show. I find romances boring generally and have no wish to see NCIS get even MORE soapish than it already is. It’s already a world away from the great little show it used to be, relying more and more on angst and romance rather than plotting some tight cases and making us care about the team interactions as they solve them.

I hope Tiva never happens. I wish they’d stop the never-ending and tedious Tiva-tease. I actually wish Cote would leave the show so we never had to worry about it again. I hate Tiva.
Anonymous

You missed out the most important – she has no respect for him, and has behaved abusively towards him, throwing him to the ground when he had a broken arm and trying to get him thrown off the team. She also takes great delight in putting him down all the time. And he only killed her boyfriend in self-defense and because he murdered a US federal agent on US soil – ie Tony was doing his job. Ziva on the other lied to the team and betrayed them. Quite frankly she isn’t good enough for Tony.

I agree with some of your other points. The more Tiva we get, the less I like the show. I find romances boring generally and have no wish to see NCIS get even MORE soapish than it already is. It’s already a world away from the great little show it used to be, relying more and more on angst and romance rather than plotting some tight cases and making us care about the team interactions as they solve them.

I hope Tiva never happens. I wish they’d stop the never-ending and tedious Tiva-tease. I actually wish Cote would leave the show so we never had to worry about it again. I hate Tiva.

Lili Pam

Lol actually NCIS gained the audiences because of Tiva. Many people are this show because of that. Even if i don’t really mind about them , but i think it is time to get them together. I laugh hard when people say it will ruin the show. I mean come if we take smaville and house or castle , especially house and smallville , wdoesn’t changed anything btw them. Lois she is still funny with clark . I think it is good to the writers putting something new on the show. Yes it is only about marines bla bla , but u should recall the fact they humain at the first place. That means they have a life , not just a job. And i begging really get bored when it is only talk about the case, it started to become like they don’t have any life or they are clark kent. So i’m not agaisnt Tiva. And it will not ruin the show , the will always be the funny part of them. If u look back in season five u could see how they will look like as couple in the future. I’m talking about the episode of jugment day. They were great together they weren’t act like Meridith and shepard. SB already gives us some aperçu of their relationship. And they know if they don’t get them together they will lost many viewrs. more than anti Tiva. Since the begging Nics never 22 millions of people who were watching them , but since they startd the Tiva stuff they gained many viewrs.

Lili Pam

Lol actually NCIS gained the audiences because of Tiva. Many people are watching this show because of that. Even if i don’t really mind about them , but i think it is time to get them together. I laugh hard when people say it will ruin the show. I mean come if we take smaville and house or castle , especially house and smallville , wdoesn’t changed anything btw them. Lois she is still funny with clark . I think it is good to the writers putting something new on the show. Yes it is only about marines bla bla , but u should recall the fact they humain at the first place. That means they have a life , not just a job. And i begging really get bored when it is only talk about the case, it started to become like they don’t have any life or they are clark kent. So i’m not agaisnt Tiva. And it will not ruin the show , the will always be the funny part of them. If u look back in season five u could see how they will look like as couple in the future. I’m talking about the episode of jugment day. They were great together they weren’t act like Meridith and shepard. SB already gives us some aperçu of their relationship. And they know if they don’t get them together as soon they will lost many viewrs. there are pro Tiva than anti Tiva. Since the begging Nics never had 22 millions of people who were watching this show , but since they startd the Tiva stuff they gained many viewrs. Lol Jeox u hate COte too much i think u should calm down. Lol it is only a show. Many people are always confusing the reality and the fiction. The writers do what they want. Cote was casted especially for Tony so i don’t think u will change anything even if u want it or not.

nomoreanvils

Don’t watch Castle. But House and Smallville are both very different shows. Smallville it is basically set in stone that those two characters get together.

I don’t see where Jeox even insinuated that they disliked Cote. And I don’t know what that has to do with the discussion in the first place. Now Season 5, I can’t even watch a couple of those episodes. you can expect a certain amount of change in a character over time but man. Enough is enough sometimes, that episode where Tony goes to Iraq with Jardine especially. That part where Ziva sees that they are sharing a room is cringeworthy. Other examples throughout the series where the anvils are too much to take, that says to me what a relationship would be like. Episodes like Knockout for example. Add in the fact that this show has never done romance well. Plus there is an entire subject on jealousy that is played on far too often.

Other things about your post need to be addressed as well. NCIS gained viewers because of Tiva? No it’s because of the syndication and word of mouth. I should know I came to the show at the start of season six because of USA and can’t stand the idea that they put those characters together, What that statement potentially holds is that some people watch only for the pairing.

They will lose viewers if they don’t put them together? Maybe so, but it’s the part of the fandom that I’ve personally seen show a sense of entitlement that it happen. That is what would lose viewers.

I’ve seen Tiva shippers lose the difference between reality and fiction to the point that they actively ship not only Tony/Ziva but Michael and Cote as well, even though Michael is married and Cote is in a relationship, if not engaged.

It may not kill the show-even though I think it would-but what would ruin the show is that the team dynamic would be changed, chemistry would be different, the entire feel of the show would be altered. The risk is too great to jeopardize the show.

Jeox

House’s ratings went down the minute they started doing Huddy to the point where they’ve now split Huddy up in an attempt to win back the ratings. NCIS’s ratings went up when it started showing reruns on USA and ION. And in fact the less Ziva/Tiva there is, the higher the ratings for an episode. Tiva will ruin the show. Tiva will lose the show viewers. It happened in House. It’ll happen in NCIS. It’s not a wildly popular ship – some love it but just as many hate it. It is by no means universally loved. Ziva herself is a very divisive character, widely disliked for her temper tantrums and abusive behavior towards Tony. Even Michael Weatherly has said he’s not a fan of the neurotic banter and talking down that is a big feature of Tiva. He made it patently clear in a recent interview just how much he hates Tiva. He rarely has a positive thing to say about it. And he’s right to dislike it, as a Tony fan himself. The only people who like and want Tiva are Ziva fans, presumably because they think it’ll be a major plotline for her. Tony fans can’t stand it. They’d rather he had his own plotlines unrelated to Mossad Barbie.

Anonymous

PS I don’t think you ARE in the minority. Everywhere I go online, from CBS to IMDB to LJ, I find people saying how much they dislike Tiva. Sure, it has a few very vocal fans, but there are a hell of a lot of very vocal people saying they don’t like it or want it too. Shane Brennan actually said in an interview about a year ago that the fanbases for and against are about equal – he was surprised I think, because he originally thought people liked Tiva, and he was taken aback to find out just HOW many loathe it. I suspect that’s why we’re caught in this perpetual boring Tiva tease. They know they can’t resolve it (until the final episodes anyway and I SO hope they don’t do that) and they can’t drop it either. So they just keep on with the endless long looks and accusations of jealousy that are becoming so tiresome. I wish they’d get over it and stop writing it in. The Tiva fans see subtext in Ziva offering Tony a pen when he’s lost his (no, really, they do – they’ve written pages on the subject) so they don’t exactly need to write it into the scripts. And bear in mind also that there are fans of many pairings on this show who all got really fed up when Tiva took over and got all the airtime. Gibbs/Abby and Tony/Gibbs fans in particular felt their pairings were shunted to one side so we could sit through yet another boring hair twirling scene from Ziva while she made yet another accusation of jealousy towards Tony for no apparent reason. Yawn.

Camelot

I went to the Paleyfest panel for NCIS in 2010, where of course Tiva came up. I think some of the cast present were also surprised at the number of the fans that don’t want Tiva. I agree that they seem to be in limbo as they don’t want to make either set of fans mad.

I personally have never liked Tiva, and I wish they would drop it already. They’ve been dragging it on for far too long to the detriment of the show. I know of many long term watchers that have watched it from the beginning and used to love it who have stopped watching it.

Mc230271

Couldn’t have agreed more.
http://pulse.yahoo.com/_Z4F7QXKOLS4UN4TQXVC6BNV374 Annie B

Amen!! Totally agree.
Keydazy09

I agree. After all that’s gone on between them there’s no way they could have a healthy relationship. Heck, they don’t have a healthy relationship *now*. Their banter has turned awfully mean over the past couple of years. And I hardly ever see Tony or Ziva show the other the respect they deserve. Ziva has problems showing due respect as an agent in particular.
Phin

I don’t ship Tiva, but I’ve got to say that your points are all kinda silly. The show would become a soap opera? Really? Just like it became a soap opera when Tony was with Jeanne?

Neither is the type to settle down? This despite Ziva almost in tears declaring that what she wanted was something permanent earlier this season, this despite Tony looking at a dead officer who left nothing and no one behind and being terrified that he’d end up the same way and having been surprised at how comforted he was with the long relationship he’d had with Jeanne? Bad experiences with previous longterm lovers doesn’t make them not the sort of settle down.

If anything, it says they are the sort to settle down, they just haven’t done so successfully. I’m not even going to bother addressing your other points.

I just think it’s sad that people feel the need to make posts like this. If it becomes canon, it becomes canon. If it doesn’t, it doesn’t. People will ship Tiva (or not ship Tiva) either way. Why bother making a post whose sole purpose seems to be to make people feel bad about their ship?

I’m sorry, but on a metatextual level your argument falls flat on every level. You want to know why I don’t think Tiva will happen? Because a) Gibbs doesn’t allow interoffice romance (so it won’t happen as long as they’re on the same team) and b) there’s more writing potential to be gained from “will they, won’t they” relationships. That is why Tiva won’t happen anytime soon, not anything that you’ve mentioned.
Phin

I don’t ship Tiva, but I’ve got to say that your points are all kinda silly. The show would become a soap opera? Really? Just like it became a soap opera when Tony was with Jeanne?

Neither is the type to settle down? This despite Ziva almost in tears declaring that what she wanted was something permanent earlier this season, this despite Tony looking at a dead officer who left nothing and no one behind and being terrified that he’d end up the same way and having been surprised at how comforted he was with the long relationship he’d had with Jeanne? Bad experiences with previous longterm lovers doesn’t make them not the sort of settle down.

If anything, it says they are the sort to settle down, they just haven’t done so successfully. I’m not even going to bother addressing your other points.

I just think it’s sad that people feel the need to make posts like this. If it becomes canon, it becomes canon. If it doesn’t, it doesn’t. People will ship Tiva (or not ship Tiva) either way. Why bother making a post whose sole purpose seems to be to make people feel bad about their ship?

I’m sorry, but on a metatextual level your argument falls flat on every level. You want to know why I don’t think Tiva will happen? Because a) Gibbs doesn’t allow interoffice romance (so it won’t happen as long as they’re on the same team) and b) there’s more writing potential to be gained from “will they, won’t they” relationships. That is why Tiva won’t happen anytime soon, not anything that you’ve mentioned.
http://twitter.com/angelmoongirl AngelMoon Girl

I want Tony and Ziva together, yes, and I think a lot of fans do too, out of the 20 plus million viewers NCIS is known for. It would almost be unfair for those of us who have waited and wished for six going on seven years to NEVER see “Tiva” happen. That said, I’m not actively pushing for it to come any sooner than the series finale, if that’s the road TPTB want to take. If it’s the end of the show anyways, what harm can “Tiva” do?
Anyways, while I can understand your concerns, I disagree with some of them, particularly number one. I think if a agent/agent romantic relationship- in this case, Tony and Ziva- was done well, but subtly so as to not take precedence over Team Gibbs as a whole, watching it unfold and grow would be very interesting and also something NCIS has never done before. Donald Bellisario, the show’s original showrunner and creator, made it clear he wasn’t afraid to go there because the idea of romantically entangled and/or married NCIS agents intrigued him. Cote de Pablo was cast BECAUSE of the chemistry she showed with Michael Weatherly. Much has changed since season three when Ziva first joined the team, and yes some of that wonderfully off-the-charts UST isn’t quite what it used to be six seasons later, but the possibility of “Tiva” is still a big draw for many viewers. So while Shane Brennan is no Bellisario, he still might- or might not- have the same idea, but is clearly going about it much slower. Which is totally fine by me Half the fun is the build-up, the bantering, and the evolution, right? I still think Tony and Ziva can “get there” by the series’ end. But if I had my way it would be sooner

Blix

And yet, every time we see Tiva on screen, the REST of the show/characters get shoved to the background and DOES take over, horrendously so.

So, wait, you’re argument for Tiva is because, as fans you think you’re entitled to it?

There are plenty of us who have watched the show LONG before Ziva even came along that feel WE’VE been cheated because we get so much Tiva and so little of the OTHER relationships that made this show what it was: Tony/Gibbs, Ducky/Gibbs, Tony/Abby.

Besides, I think Brennan was surprised to discover there are just as many vocal fans who actively hate Tiva as those who do.
Anonymous

Watching it unfold would be very interesting to YOU. To some of us it would be torture. And as we’ve said, those who don’t like or want Tiva are as numerous as those who do, according to Shane Brennan himself, and you don’t have to look far around the internet, including this blog entry, to see just as many people hating Tiva as loving it. Why should WE have it inflicted on us more than it already is just because YOU feel entitled to it?

I’ve been watching the show since the beginning and I want the show *I* enjoyed (which was one with no Tiva in it) – why is your enjoyment more important than MINE? Lots of us see no UST or chemistry between them. You might, but plenty don’t. And some watch despite the terrible Tiva scenes they insert every so often. Scenes that go nowhere and can go nowhere while they want to keep the tease intact but not annoy part of their viewing fanbase by making Tiva happen.

I do not want to watch Tiva unfold and grow onscreen. I will stop watching the show if that happens. There is no way they can have Tiva happen and it not take over the entire show and become all that Tony and Ziva are as characters with no other plotlines but Tiva or how anything they do affects Tiva. It’s already bad enough as it is, and that’s at the tease stage, it’d be so much worse if it was more than this.

And while you may see fun bantering, I just see Ziva putting Tony down all the time for whatever jollies she gets out of that. Even one of the Tiva posters above seems to think that in a relationship Ziva would need to tell Tony off. I cannot see that as a healthy relationship. She’s already got a bullying streak – the last thing Tony needs is to be in a relationship with someone who enjoys putting him down. And it’s the last thing I want to watch.

I think far from being romantics, those who enjoy Tiva actually just get a bit of wish fulfilment from seeing their favorite character (Ziva) kick Tony repeatedly. I think if their genders were reversed, and Tony behaved towards Ziva as she has towards him, that people would be a lot more uncomfortable with it but I get the impression a lot of Tiva fans are living out some weird battle of the sexes wish fulfilment via Tiva.

Kath

My psych prof said it better than I ever could (and I hope this comes out right, my mother tongue is not English): Rape fantasies can be fun but in reality hooking up with an abusive partner never works.

Since I see Ziva’s behavior as abusive and her as emotionally unstable any romantic relationship is doomed in my eyes.

New311

TIVA are meant to be..there is no logic…a heart wants what it wants….for me they are already in love……

Camelot7414

No logic is right, no logic to why Tony even stands her. She treats him like crap.

Twilightrocket

I think that they are in love with each other, but are to scared/proud/pig-headed/worried to admit it to themselves and each other. I mean, who goes and get’s themselves captured and tortured to seek ‘revenge’ on the man who killed their partner? And the way Tony reacted when he saw she was alive, was just perfect, also the ‘Couldnt live without you’ and ‘If i could drag her back I would. But It’s no use. Ziva David is dead.’ Lines were a true snippet into how he feels about her, also when the P2P killer took Ziva, and Tony was like, ‘Well It’s differnent for some of us’ to EJ showed that he cares about her more than friends. They both are perfect for each other. Ok, having just read through most of these posts I have come to the following conclusions:
1. Sure Ziva ‘chews him out’ half the time, but it’s not mean, it’s playful.
2. They may both be too high maintenece and damged, but that’s what makes them so perfect for each other.
3. When something bad happens to one of them, they always go to the other.
4. Sure Ziva has violent outbursts sometimes, but lets face it, if someone just shot your bf dead in your living room, you’d be kinda pissed too. And shes a train assasin, so it’s basically a second nature. Also, she puts a very high price on loyalty.
5. Something tell’s me that they would go to the end of the world to save each other, and being together would not change this.

I have more ramblings, but I’ll leave it at this for the mean time, lol.
Gretabanks

1- NCIS is a drama. There is supposed to be drama!
2- if they got together it doesn’t necessarily mean settling down, especially since Gibbs forbids it and it would be a secret. But even then, both of them are getting older and after jeanne Tony said he wanted something more permanent!
3- there fight would be even more funny because they would be even more secret and McGee would be 10X more confused
4- there is no window. Their relationship is always changing. Early on they would fight in honest annoyance at one another. Now it’s lighter, no animosity. They trust each other and share secrets
5- they would already risk their lives for each other, Zivas level headed enough to keep emotions out of work when necessary and Tony, if it’s a woman at all he’s already distracted. As they were trying to diffuse a bomb that could go off any second Tony was looking down zivas shirt. He then proceeded to comment. If anything it would make Tony more careful seeing as he is usually fairly careless.

Dont hate on Tiva.
http://twitter.com/greenleo1 Julia G

“Couldn’t live without you, I guess” Tony’s line to Ziva basically says it all. The man risked his life and career for Ziva. That’s love in my opinion. And it’s something the writers have been building and developing since the first episode that Ziva showed up in.

Michael and Cote have AMAZING chemistry together. And fans love them. There are a few “loud” haters who hate ZIVA with a passion…but you’ll get haters in ANY tv show. As the saying goings, “haters will go on hating…” And I think the haters know that you dislike Tiva, so they read your reviews more often than let’s say fans like me who LOVE Tiva.

Ultimately, judging from the HUGE buzz from the fans and the media, Tiva is popular. In many different countries, actually. And the writers took their time with them for years and years. To throw that storyline away would be horrible writing. Why build up a pairing for years and give them so much focus to simply drop the storyline because of the “fear” of going there? That would be pretty bad writing.

Many many shows these days get couples together. Ross/Rachel Monica/Chandler on Friends, and the show lasted 10 years I believe. House/Cuddy, Bones/Booth, JD/Elliot(Scrubs), Chuck/Sarah (Chuck), etc…Couples do not destroy shows. And excellent writers will always make storylines amazing. No matter what. You have to trust the writers.

I do believe that the writers made the mistake ofrdragging Tiva for years, though. In more realistic terms, they should have gotten together in season 7.

And to be honest, I don’t think you like Ziva from what I read in your columns. You even made a whole topic on Kensi being better than Ziva for some reason. And to me that doesn’t exactly express a likeness for a character. Such topics will always create negativity.

Those who are opposed to Tiva are 90% of pure Ziva haters who enjoy calling her a violent and sadistic individual. I don’t believe that it is you. I just don’t think you like her that much. And it’s hard to be unbiased if you don’t particularly like a certain person in a pairing.

Honestly, most Tiva fans I know have been invested in Tiva for close to 7 years. It would be really unfair and terrible for the writers to have teased the Tiva fans in a huge way for 7 years just to say “never mind” later on. That would really upset the fans. It would be a huge tease and usage of those fans.

TV Equals

5 Reasons Why “Tiva” Should Never Happen [NCIS]

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